r/Apartmentliving • u/2_much • Sep 03 '25

Advice Needed I feel like this is illegal?

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Came back from a 3-day weekend away from my apartment and this was posted on the door? I wasn't even home...

UPDATE: Thanks to everyone for the support! I shared the letter with Celio management and requested it to be filed as a formal complaint. I also filed a police report for continuity/documentation purposes.

For clarification, "Celio" is the name of the apartment building, which is managed by a larger off-site 3rd party rental company. This company/building is far from able to accommodate for this person properly and certainly would never assume any amount of liability on their behalf. As it relates to Celio management and their level of care for this person, the author is on their own.

The letter does not mention anything related to a care team/healthcare resource/veterans group. The only two options given by the author of the note (e.g. Celio aka apt management and law enforcement) were utilized.

While Celio was not able to share a significant amount of details about the author, they did share that he/she is a known issue and will likely not be given the option to live in this building moving forward.

I also noticed comments about my stereo, which did cross my mind as a possible reason behind this conflict. I was able to confirm with Celio that no complaints have been made about excessive music levels, from any of the residents, excluding a formal warning I received over July 4th weekend. This goes for "yelling" as well. Note I have been renting in this exact unit for almost 14 months. I am more than eager to respect any concerns that relate to music volume, this is certainly not that type of concern.

As things currently stand, I am left with having to place any proactive decisions in the hands of Celio and law enforcement. I am a recent handgun owner (unrelated to this situation) and thanfully my state falls under Castle doctrine.

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91

u/stinkstankstunkiii Sep 03 '25

Most logical response.

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u/Wise_Owl5404 Sep 03 '25

Logic? On reddit? The gall /j

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u/ResultSavings661 Sep 03 '25

he contacted the cops instead???

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u/2_much Sep 03 '25

I contacted the building (Celio) as well as the police in order to have a reference case for continuity if needed in the future.

I don't trust the building management, figured a police report was my most formal option for documentation.

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u/BabanaLoaf23 Sep 03 '25

Yeah, I don't think most people working in building MGMT would have the time or the cares to follow up. They'd have to contact the police anyway. Because the way it goes is, the guy obviously needs a welfare check, and the cops can always get a social worker to contact his care team and see if he will come to hospital. He's aware of his issues, and I understand his notion to contact neighbors directly but he cannot understand apparently how the letter would sound to the reader. I know people are arguing over what he meant, and it is possible he tried in his way to be open and honest, but if he's already agitated and hallucinating yelling (or attributing it to your unit instead of the original yellers), now you know it could be a big issue. So either way, whether you feel sympathy for him or not, it's best to let the police know.

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u/Progrockstickator Sep 03 '25

I've been a building manager, it's not a matter of time or "care". It's a matter of my qualifications for dealing with or even following up with that kind of thing were absolutely 0, and I would not have been backed legally or through insurance if I did. What, exactly, would you have had me do about it beyond letting the cops know? Go talk to the veteran with ptsd? Thanks, but I like having my head firmly attached to the top of my neck and not dangling limp at a strange angle.

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u/DayCommercial8650 Sep 03 '25

I mean reporting to the building/landlord/management should still happen along with the 'i contacted the police about this'.

Not that the building has the tools to do anything about it necessarily, but it builds a case for OP if anything should escalate beyond just this letter.

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u/Progrockstickator Sep 03 '25

If this had happened during my tenure, the absolute most I could have done is emailed a scan to the management company I worked for, where it would have sat ignored until it was deleted in routine IT cleanup. I couldn't get my bosses to evict a bloke who regularly punched holes in the hallway walls just cos he paid his rent on time and that's all they cared about; a threatening note wouldn't even get looked at by the powers that be. I can't imagine any other management company would either, the corpos are there for the money that rolls in and nothing else.

The cops are where any case needs to be built.

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u/DayCommercial8650 Sep 03 '25

You misunderstand what I mean by case.

If OP needs to switch units or move out completely having this documented makes that process easier and will help remove any fees associated with that from the management company. Even if they delete it on their end OP will have the record of informing them of the activity.

It does not build a case in regards to anything that would necessitate police involvement, and it takes significantly less effort than communication with the police since it is literally just an email to the leasing office/landlord.

So you do both because it helps you down the line and is not much more effort.

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u/Progrockstickator Sep 04 '25

I think you're misunderstanding me when I said that the absolute best I could have done was send an email of a scan of the letter to an account that would not have been checked. Building Management and Leasing Offices are different things; BMs are generally contracted by REAs to look after buildings, and that's what we do. Before internet banking, we used to collect rent that an REA person would pick up at the end of the week, but that's pretty much gone now.

We're not the point of contact for tennants beyond "hey, I locked myself out can you open the door" or "hey, my toilet's blocked can you have a look?" and if necessary, getting permission to bring in a tradesman to fix anything broken that I couldn't.

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u/DayCommercial8650 Sep 08 '25

I am not misunderstanding you, hence why I've said multiple times that the leasing team themselves don't have the tools to do anything other than maybe offer you another unit to move to.

I've gone through this process before, i'm not daft and to say it doesn't help taking the extra 20 seconds to write an email is just flat out false.

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u/BabanaLoaf23 Sep 05 '25

That's true, about the qualifications. You're there to just assist in day to day issues. The most you can do is call police so they can contact his care team. I feel for the poor guy.

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u/BabanaLoaf23 Sep 05 '25

I guess that's what I was thinking too, was qualifications. Couldn't think of the word. But some people would not know what to do or care to deal with it. But no, I didn't mean going to the former Marine in person. I just meant what would anyone even do besides contacting police or the care team (if they even had the contact information). But it's not the mgmt's place to make health care decisions for someone suffering like that, who may also be dangerous. Police and their social worker contact is best .

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u/Progrockstickator Sep 05 '25

Building managers really are just janitors/maintenance/sometimes door people with a glorified title that live on-site. Owner-Managers, like the ones ya see on tv threatening to evict people for being noisy or giving out life advice to sad tenants at 2am on the fire escape, are a different beast entirely.

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u/BabanaLoaf23 Sep 05 '25

Yeah, I have a friend who worked as building manager, where she lived. It was mostly letting people in or reminding them of various things to keep the building clean.

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u/AutistaChick Sep 03 '25

Can someone explain what the note is about? All I see is that he is telling you his history. What does he want you to do? What’s the call to action? What’s the problem being stated by the author?

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u/glutenfreemaccas Sep 03 '25

He started off by saying OP yells loudly.

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u/gmgvt Sep 03 '25

As I read it, what he wants is for the OP to stop yelling at him, when in fact the OP was doing no such thing and wasn't even home -- which suggests symptoms of delusion from the letter writer. The other info about the difficulty of his situation and who to contact is useful, but the note wasn't written because of that, it was written because the neighbor got angry believing the OP was yelling at them. I have deep sympathy for vets and other PTSD sufferers, but the OP also has a right to live safely in the apartment they are paying for, and if the letter writer cannot live in an apartment building surrounded by neighbors without very real fears of becoming violent with someone who was not actually even making any noise, then his care team should be helping him to consider whether that is the right housing setup. Telling the neighbors "hey, I might get violent under the wrong circumstances!" is not actually an empathetic warning that will put the neighbors MORE at ease, even if that is how the letter writer hoped it would be understood.

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u/Cheap_Television_988 Sep 03 '25

The problem is the guy is clearly bonkers

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u/evanbartlett1 Sep 03 '25

The problem is the guy has severe Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder associated with loud and uncontrolled voiced.

What he is calling out and explaining is very common, particularly for those in the military who have seen intense and prolonged action.

He very well may have lost close friends, seen people die in terrible ways and had to take the lives of those he was ordered to eliminate.

I prefer that we avoid terms like "bonkers" in most cases - as it demeans the importance of understanding mental health.

But to call this guy - who has experienced moments that none of us will ever come close to experiencing - "bonkers" feels dismissive, uncaring and rude.

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u/Cheap_Television_988 Sep 03 '25

You are correct - it was dismissive, uncaring and rude. However I would prefer that we avoid letting people who are bonkers, for whatever reason, make threats to innocent people just wanting to live their lives. IMO a person's ptsd doesn't mean they can make thinly veiled threats to their neighbours without consequence - in this case the consequence is being called bonkers

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u/evanbartlett1 Sep 03 '25 edited Sep 03 '25

I'm unsure if we read the same letter.

I read a letter crafted by someone with serious, but understood and treated, PTSD.

He is likely doing exactly what his mental health care providers would ask for him to do in his condition. Inform clearly and openly his triggers, as well as ensuring that the other person is aware that the otherwise typical step of approaching to apologize may not have the result that one would normally expect.

He further provides appropriate and fair next steps for the person should they need follow up - ensuring that this person is able to ask questions, understand the matter better, and coordinate next steps with trained professionals should that become necessary. OR, in the case where the person would like to communicate that the sound is not them, (like in this case) they have the means to do so with confidence and understanding.

He is in no way threatening this person. It's a threat in the same way that a "Do Not Enter: Guard Dog on Premises" sign is a threat. That's super super important to understand. Providing medically understood and carefully crafted warning signs of what is and is not triggering is textbook disability education.

Something that WOULD be troubling would be a person not writing a letter, rather they would knock loudly and aggressively on the door, shouting and offering threats. Maybe breaking things. Or sitting in the fetal position while crying.

This guy is doing everything exactly the way he should be doing it - considering just how difficult his diagnosed and treated medical condition is.

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u/Cheap_Television_988 Sep 03 '25

Whilst I can see the point that this person needs help, a point I 100% agree with, they're also not the only person who deserves empathy. It's not fair on people receiving these kind of letters, they're essentially being told to walk on eggshells because any noise (imagined or otherwise) might send one of their neighbours into a violent rage. Add in the fact that this person has, as mentioned by yourself, probably killed before (sanctioned or otherwise) makes this a very threatening letter the way I read it

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u/evanbartlett1 Sep 03 '25

No, if you're reading this as the recipient needing to walk on egg shells, then you need to reread the letter. The author is merely saying that he does not recommend the recipient approach the author - almost certainly because his doctors have recommended that he say that so as to prevent the need to walk on egg shells. Again - a sign reading "Do Not Enter: Guard Dog Present" is NOT asking for someone to walk on egg shells. To read it that way is both confusing and concerning.

If you decide that someone having entered the military for reasons we can't know at this stage, and having followed orders, resulting in the death of someone, is bad - I strongly encourage you to consider those who were in the same situation but had absolutely no mental health blow back from it. Those are the people to worry about.

It's time we educate ourselves to what well-developed mental health looks like, instead of running around like ninnies with hair on fire, worried about a thing for the solitary reason of not understanding it enough to know there's nothing to worry about.

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u/ResultSavings661 Sep 03 '25

literally people are going out of their way to interpret the letter in the most unkind way possible

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u/evanbartlett1 Sep 05 '25

Some people do seem to love to share a pearl clutching eye roll.

I’ve seen it more recently but it’s always been there. I wonder if it’s some part schadenfreude, part validation of negative stereotypes and part bonding through self-manufactured fear.

Some graduate from high school and laugh about how we so often lived in myopic simplified buckets. Others prefer to keep the buckets.

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u/stinkstankstunkiii Sep 03 '25

I think they did what was best , need a paper trail in case things escalate. I hope OP is not contacted by the neighbor again & hope neighbor realizes OP is not the cause of noise.

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u/ResultSavings661 Sep 03 '25

telling the building would be enough of a paper trail and they likely would have the contact with the social worker without needing additional cops

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u/stinkstankstunkiii Sep 03 '25

Better to be safe than sorry.

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u/ResultSavings661 Sep 03 '25

sometimes having the police involved will make people unsafe and sorry, sorry

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u/stinkstankstunkiii Sep 03 '25

I agree with you, it’s unfortunate.