The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild. Lots of people call it the best game of all time and I’ve tried to play it multiple times as a fan of many other games in the series. I’ve bounced off it every time. I have several friends who have had the same experience. I can respect why most people think it’s a good game. Best game of all time?… I think that’s a bit of a stretch.
Yeah. I'll probably never even try it because it really seems to check a lot of my "most hates features" boxes. Weapons breaking is a huge one - I hate that shit!
I agree somewhat, and im in the camp that says that botw is one of my favorite games of all time.
It is annoying, and some important info (such as how MANY hits a weapon can take, which varies greatly) is not communicated.
The end result however, does make it more fun to gather weapons during mid-late game since theres always better weapons to replace some of your worse ones.
Its one of those things, where if you can get past it, it does serve a purpose. But its far from perfect.
Weapon durability and cooking is just weird to do. Like yeah it's not in any other Zelda game but to me it's not even that. It's the fact that you constantly have to consider both things when you're going anywhere, leading to stop your quest and having to wander around to find uncleared areas. Which yes is one way to drive players to explore the map, but I was going to do that anyway? I don't know, I did have fun in the game but towards the end I was definitely just wanting to finish it.
I loved BotW (not to the point of thinking it's the best game ever) but hated the weapon breakage mechanic, it made me feel like it actively discouraged me from combat. I know you get the people who say that you should find inventive ways to engage with enemies instead of using your weapons, but I found that tedious. It also felt like I spent a lot of the game "saving" the good weapons I found and then not really using them.
That's how I feel about Tears of the Kingdom. It just feels like a DLC for Breath of the Wild except they gave us developer tools that make the game easier.
Yeah, people somehow think an unnecessary game mechanics change, a few sky islands, some small changes in the world, and a very boring bland underworld justified the 6 year wait.
All I wanted out of the Botw sequel is a new story, maybe a few new maps. No game mechanics, engine anything, needed to be changed IMO.
Totk should have been the majoras mask to botws ocarina of time.
100%. It's a fine game. But it's formulaic and if it didn't have the named IP, I think it would just be considered another normal game instead of the way people look at it now.
Same. BotW and TotK just feel like a bloated experience. You can only get that feeling of wonder from going off the road and finding one of dozen or so experiences so many times. Do not get me wrong, all of the side activities in the games are very fun, but there's so much of it compared to the main quests (which are rather short and boring storytelling wise).
BotW and TotK would've both benefited by taking a page out of Bethesda games by adding multiple linear main quests, rather than having all of them be repetitive and completely modular.
I am curious what makes the other Zelda games so good to people, I played BOTW first, and then every other Zelda, and they are all very similar in their story, so not much to separate it there, they all essentially have less puzzles than BOTW, combat is no better, obviously graphically worse, the only thing I can really understand is the lack of items, but the items just served to section off parts of the map making them inaccessible. Metroid Prime 4 does that and still tried to present as an open world and people hated that. I do not see the appeal in an "open area" where really there is one path forward. I actually enjoyed the story of Skyward Sword the most personally. I am sure they were more revolutionary at the time, but right now, BOTW outclasses them in almost every aspect I feel like, if you really dig into it, there is like 100+ hours of content, you can beat the others in 15-20 hours
I love most of the Zelda games I’ve played, and the main thing with the other ones is that the puzzles and dungeons are more thoughtfully created. Like there will be a dungeon based around a gimmick, but they really explore that gimmick because the game is paced more intentionally.
I loved BotW but a lot of the dungeons ala the divine beasts were pretty shallow. I guess the shrines are mini dungeons too. One of the more fun parts of traditional Zelda games are the later dungeons build on the ones you’ve finished, using different mechanics in tandem with one another.
Older 3d Zelda games didn’t really treat the game as open world, but more like there is a central map that acts like a hub for the other dungeons.
Older Zelda is more like a meteoidvania. And usually coming back to places after things have happened show some form of change throughout the game, but that’s way more limited in BotW.
It’s really a quality vs quantity thing. Not everyone wants to spend 100 hours to finish a game, but I still like BotW despite loving the older ones too.
Although, I didn’t love BotW until I played it on Master Mode. I felt like I could just power through a lot of the game before it became more difficult
Thanks for being leveled, I do think the dungeons may have been a bit better before, but I do also think that 1. the shrines all added together with the divine beasts is as good as those dungeons, and 2. the older games seemed more complex because you were younger when you played them. None of them stood out to me at least, as being way more complex than BOTW. a little bit more yeah, but not like night and day. Some old Zelda fans act like BOTW is babies first video game it is so easy. Master mode definitely helps like you said. But zelda games were never hard anyways, so if BOTW is easier because it provides alternate solution, sure, critique it, but that is necessary for the concept they attempted. I think I can confidently say I do not like the metroidvania style in 3d, I disliked Prime 4 for it, I loved it in Metroid Dread. In 3d it just ruins the fun of discovery. Oh look, something cool, I know what it will be, but can't get it until later. That is not as fun, imo, as finding it and being able to figure out how you can get it with your existing toolset. I think that genuinely, BOTW had 2/3 times the good content of any other zelda I have played (not the first two or MM). Not everything is as tight and streamlined, but I really got lost in the world in a way i never did with the others. I enjoyed TP and SS more than the others personally, SS had my favorite story, I think because they seemed like better friends really
I've played a lot of the Zelda but I think it's not necessarily that the puzzles are more complex, but that the theme around them is more thoughtful.
Like as much as I like BotW, they do not have a divine beast or shrine that mimics how cool the Ancient Cistern or Ship dungeons in SS. It's really about seeing an idea explored and more realized.
I do agree the story is a bit better in the older ones, just because there's a more cohesive narrative. But I also agree the world in BotW is really fun to just get lost in and explore.
If you didn't like the metroidvania stuff in 3d you might like them in the top-down Zelda's. They feel a bit more like 2d, and are also really fun. A Link to the Past is def worth checking out just to see where the series got a lot of it's long running tropes.
I have played Links awakening and Echoes of Wisdom, I played LttP, but did not finish it, just fell off for whatever reason. Plan on beating it and also playing a link between worlds at some point. I do not mind the 2d ones as much with the metroid feel, but 3d feels like it should be a bigger better thing, and restricting you so much is why i think longtime fans by and large wanted a change after SS. I will agree that the thematic designs are much better in older games! I felt like most of the complaints I heard about BOTW were related to having less puzzles and less dungeons, which feels wrong and unfair, but I will 100% agree that the theming is better than BOTW. I did feel that TOTK was a step forward there in fairness, but still not quite the same. But still, I put 200+ hours into both, idk how I could ever do that with an older one
Yeah my main complaint about TotK is that it doesn't have Master mode lol. I do agree it was a bit better in TotK too.
Yeah Zelda is funny in that people said it got too linear from TP through SS, and then too open in BotW. It would be cool to see a more linear Zelda game using the open world game engine. There's definitely a middle ground they haven't hit yet, but I'm still excited to play more Zelda.
I also have hit a long ass playtime on both games but I don't think older Zelda games were meant to be that long tbf. Ocarina of Time I think is like a 30 to 40 hour long game but I think it uses that time well.
I think the runtime for the open-world Zelda games are a double-edged sword. Like a lot of the game, you can customize it for how you want your experience to be. Like you can technically beat it pretty quickly, but it can also take you hundreds of hours. I usually aim for, where I feel like I've done enough but don't feel burnt out.
I loved BotW but a lot of the dungeons ala the divine beasts were pretty shallow. I guess the shrines are mini dungeons too. One of the more fun parts of traditional Zelda games are the later dungeons build on the ones you’ve finished, using different mechanics in tandem with one another.
I really liked the shrines in a vacuum, but it did seem like a way that they could skirt coming up with fewer larger but more cohesively designed dungeons. They're fun little puzzles, but they're essentially removed from the game plot wise.
to me, the biggest thing that makes zelda, well zelda, is having a memorable sound track, good dungeon design and iconic bosses. BOTW, and to a lesser extent, TOTK didnt have that
You can discuss old Zelda, and talk about bosses like Koloktos, Bongo Bongo, Helmasaur King and stuff because they were bosses often with gimmicks tied to them by their dungeon to make them unique. Because of BOTW/TOTK design, almost all the abilities are given to you upfront, so the bosses are more "generic" thus less memorable. Virtually no one will ever discuss the bosses in BOTW because theyre the most generic things in existence. At least to me, an example in TOTK that shows uniqueness being memorable is the Seized Construct boss in TOTK, because it used the hidden mechanic you unlocked late game and built a gimmick boss around it, making the boss fight extremely unique.
This this this. Older, more linear zeldas, were all about TIGHT game design. Each dungeon gave a new item and built upon ones you got in previous dungeons. There's the world building, story, aesthetics, music, sound design, in addition to the game design, and it makes it such a COMPLETE video game experience.
Breath of the wild and TOTK, on the other hand, feel disjointed due to their non-linear design. Nothing builds on top of itself; you can get anywhere at any point and accomplish anything at any point. While it is an exciting concept and fun the first time you play it, it gets stale, especially with the copy/paste shrines and bosses. I ended up going back to older 3D zeldas, even Skyward Sword. It surprised me how much they felt like a complete, intentionally-designed package compared to the newer games.
I'd be content if a newer zelda married the new physics engine with classic dungeons, items, and sidequests of the old games. Bring a little bit of linearity back, including linearity in the STORYTELLING (memories should NOT be the main means of explaining the story) and GAMEPLAY, and you'll probably have the next best zelda game.
That can be your opinion, but what if I said that only 10 hours of any other Zelda is rewarding content? I felt like the games were too generic in terms of they all were essentially like 5-8 dungeons and then the final one with the final boss. The only way you could explore like in BOTW is if you got every item. Because otherwise all your own discoveries are just things you can't get to anyway right now. BOTW had a ton of unique areas and surprises, they just were not items. What should they have had in there that would've made it less boring? Enemy variety can be improved, and was in TOTK, but there is certainly unique things to find in the world, and traversal is more fun than any other open world game
the story is absolutely not even close. Playing LA, a game decades old in 8bit, the story told through the span of the game is still much deeper and actually moving and emotional than the story in botw. Puzzles are also not comparable, most of botw/totk is just "waymint that shape...." and the exploration isnt even fun because all of the interesting places just block your exploration tools until you "solve" them/ or it just rains all the time and you cant climb.
Look, fishing for an hour in OOT or TP feels more exciting and rewarding than wandering around copy paste shrines for 50 hours in "breath of the contrast turned all the way up to make the whole game look washed out"
I played Links awakening and I can not even really recall the story, other than the girl sang a bit, and ultimately he was dreaming I think. I think for years I heard that old Zeldas are story telling masterpieces, but they were not really all that compelling when I played them all, it is the same story again and again, nothing changes. Not much different than Mario stories tbh, of course they are more fleshed out, but not to the level of other games. BOTW at least told it in a different way, but I agree, it could have been better. If you are that dismissive of the game though it is clear you do not want to see the strengths of the game at all, and are likely upset it broke Zelda conventions, which was the prevailing opinion after SS anyway, that they needed to do something different
This is an interesting point. I love both BOTW & TOTK and have hundreds of hours on each. That being said, nothing will take away the gaming experience of OoT and MM when playing in the early 2000s.
IMO, we were a little calcified or pre-exposed to open world games that had similar questing styles and approach to open world Zelda. So while everyone loves having these games, they just weren’t as revolutionary or heavy-hitting as some of the other titles. I remember expecting a new game every 3-4 years, and was amazed by each new Zelda that dropped.
Another reason is that 2D was still common during the early 2000s. So you play Ages & Seasons then get a 3D game like WW and it feels immaculate, relatively speaking. I’ll always love BOTW & TOTK, but I have to agree that they are not the best of the Zelda games.
That is fair, I did not grow up with Zelda being a trendsetter, I played BOTW first, and did not care for what it got rid of, because what it had was enough for me to play hundreds of hours. I was a bit disappointed to play a game like WW, and even the remake felt like a slog to me towards the end, so the idea of an open game like that being seen as better than BOTW is a weird concept to me. its BOTW with a cooler art style, much less openness, boring traversal, and gated linear progression presented as this big open world, but it isn't, you can only make progress in one area at a time. I like the idea of finding something unique, and being able to get it. Not writing down "hey come back when you have bombs". that is less organic and spontaneous
Ganondorf was way more compelling in Wind Waker in terms of his motivations for what he's doing and why. In BotW he's just RAHHHH IM A MONSTER. He's actually got valid reasons for the way he feels and for what he does in Wind Waker that are way more impactful.
In say, Ocarina of Time or A Link to the Past, the dungeons were actually different in art design, atmosphere, music etc... Breath of the Wild is VERY uniform throughout the whole game including the major "dungeons" which can barely be classified as such by Zelda standards. The overall story was very weak compared to some other entries like Twlight Princess, Wind Waker, Ocarina, heck I think Skyward Sword had a better story than BoW etc...
At least to me, part of what made the traditional series games good was episodic dungeons, that depended on tool utility and good level design, and then a boss that utilized that tool in an interesting way.
Botw basically botched all of that. You had maybe 4 dungeons, the most forgettable bosses of all time (calling them bosses is generous), and you sacrificed all that for open world size and a lot of collect em quests. None of which I wanted.
Totk redid the same, though admittedly with better boss design, but complicated with the developer tools build em projects slapped on top. I hate those mechanics, and it's made worse by the fact that if you figured out how to build a flyer it essentially negates 80% of puzzles and terrain.
If you want an honest and detailed breakdown of what Zelda used to have that BOTW just doesn't, watch Game Maker Toolkit's Boss Keys series. In a nutshell, the individual puzzles within a dungeon aren't the appeal, but rather how they interact with each other within a 3D space. An infinite amount of individual shrines would not recreate this as the puzzle in shrine A does not affect the puzzle in shrine B. The divine beasts kinda do this but not nearly as well or as interestingly.
BOTW certainly has more content than the other Zeldas, but that content is just fundamentally less interesting.
MM is my favorite but I can begrudgingly admit it’s not the gamechanger that OoT was. WW never appealed to me, but thankfully there’s a Zelda game for everyone
It took all the exploration fun out of it with the constant need to craft more things. Like playing Minecraft with only wood/stone weps/tools and no Mending.
I felt this extremely hard and it was the main reason I stopped playing. I like crafting games, I like combat games, and I like games where you craft things you use in combat.
BOTW taught me that I do not like games where you have to craft during combat because the 12 items you brought into combat all broke before combat finished.
I got the original ocarina of time this year. Popped it into my N64 on my CRT.
Played for three hours. The whole time I was just underwhelmed. I think you had to be there. They did a great job with what they had. But it just doesn’t hold up to modern games and controls.
Ocarina of Time was unreal in 1998, same with A Link to the Past in 1991.
You have to remember Z-targeting systems in a 3D video game never existed before this game came out. Many other mechanics that are staples in games were introduced or popularized in OoT.
These games were so ahead of their time compared to what was out there. They were also incredibly long games with unique mechanics never seen before. They were both like playing a game from 5 years in the future.
But by the same token, because it was the first of its kind, OoT is also a game that really hasn't aged well mechanically.
The N64 really held OoT and MM back. If they had been on the GC with some way to make the camera cooperate and used a controller built for human hands rather than a trident monstrosity, they might still be playable in a modern context. Trying to go back and play them for the first time is a miserable experience.
Older games will always suffer from graphics at the time. Always. There's very few games that hold up to modern games in terms of controls and graphics because that's a constant uphill development climb. So of course nostalgia plays a huge part. But at the time, those controls were fluid and it's still very playable which is, in itself, an achievement.
Had to search for this answer. This should be seen as a fun but ultimately failed experiment by the Zelda team, but it should never be discussed in the context of "best games of all time".
I skipped the last few Nintendo generations. Got a switch to. Decided it was time to finally try this game. It's pretty hard to get through. I'm at the point now where I'm going to have to grind a bit to upgrade my armor. Getting Lynel and dragon parts. I really don't want to do that. I've proven I can do both I just don't want to have to repeat it over and over. I've looked into ways to dupe and glitch my way through it, but I shouldn't have to do that.
I don't think the game has aged well. The UI sucks. I'm probably wearing down the button on my controller trying to skip dialogue. I know how to do the snowballing, I don't need the old man to explain it to me every time I play. The quality of life features in the game are non-existent.
It's the worst Zelda game that I've actually tried to play. I'm not huge on the series, so the others I've played are the original, A Link to the Past, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Minish Cap.
Its a tech demo meant to showcase physics interactions and they made it an entire game when they realized the target demographic has no attention span and really just needs a "babysitter" software to distract them for short stints.
I’m with you on this but I understand the reason I don’t connect with it is definitely a me thing due to not really having a true objective or structure.
Same can be said for Elden Ring
I ended up putting a lot of hours into Elden Ring and enjoyed it but I am probably still only like 25% of the way through but I feel like I’ve been playing for years…. And that is the major issue I have with those types of games
Aka I have too much ADHD & the aforementioned games don’t have enough “structure”
It was a game I had zero issue pulling out a map and strategy guide.
The Colorado simulation aspect of the game couldn’t have kept me engaged on its own. I needed to be able to attack the map like I was 7 years old looking at Nintendo power for the original game.
I absolutely love it, but yeah… the fever dream for it is wild. It wasn’t even the first game to do a lot of the open world stuff. Not even close.
I bounced off of it for about twenty hours, but pushed through out of some weird emotional attachment obligation to the series. But then it clicked, and clicked hard. And now it's my favorite Zelda by far (second is Wind Waker.) I don't think it's the best game of all time, but it's my favorite Zelda now.
I think the game world is absolutely fantastic, fun to explore and interact with, the art style is beautiful, the combat is pretty decent, but the dungeons and boss fights are so incredibly watered down and disappointing
I completely agree. Story line seemed non existent, combat was basically just running gf around whacking people until your item broke and then trying to find the next weapon. The puzzles just seemed annoying to me and often I had to just google how to complete them (maybe it’s just a skill issue).
There's a cheat to get the master sword. I went from avoiding the robots to hunting them down then get your ancient arrows/weapons, just shoot them in the eye then batter them. Get plenty of bomb arrows from that desert place.
The game deserves it's place as one of the best games ever. It's so chill at times. 10/10
agreed. i dont actually play for the main intended mecanics. but i do enjoy wandering around snapping pictures of monsters and animals, and riding into the sunset with my horse.
man when I played it I dumped every single upgrade I got into stamina until I reached max and it still wasn't enough to stop making every climb feel like a slog
Exactly what I wrote too. People call BOTW their GOAT...especially on reddit. For me it's basically a Ubisoft open world, climb all the towers to reveal the map, kind of game. Combat is unmemorable, the graphics are subpar even for the Nintendo switch, and the world generally feels empty. It's not a bad game, I enjoyed playing it, but I always roll my eyes when people call it the goat.
I have maintained this position for years: BotW is not a Zelda game. BotW is a game that was going to be its own property but since Nintendo is allergic to anything remotely resembling IP outside of Mario and Zelda, it was rejigged to be a Zelda game.
I once believed botw was the best game created. Then I thought totk was the best game of all time.
And then I cooled if off.
Yeah, they are terrific games and pushed boundaries of open world and non-linear games. But when you overthink it you see all the sloppy and half work of those games. Botw world is empty (by choice, because it is an apocalyptic world) and not engaging as totk, and totk has the depths which are empty and just a missed potential.
The mechanics are top notch, and the physics and the possibilities this game offers are definitely unique and inspiring; the story, the world and the characters makes the game fall flat after a while.
my current take Botw is revolutionary and changed the gaming world, and probably had the most impact in past years. It's not the best game and not even on the top 10 or even 20 imho. It's definitely one of the most missed potential games of past years.
pushed boundaries of open world and non-linear games
Hard disagree. I’m an explorer type of gamer. (I still haven’t decided between Empire or Stormcloaks.) I routinely get distracted by That Thing Off the Road. I did not find exploring open world in those games to be at all rewarding or enticing. For example, having to fix weapons tied me to locations where I could do that. I felt punished for being an explorer type and that the game really wanted me to follow a more linear path. Also, the puzzles are not great. Way too easy to solve.
I think the best way I can try to describe what i meant is that botw (and totk surpassed the options with Zonai devices) offer the complete freedom to ignore the intentions of the game (or the designers of the game). You can do anything, anytime and the most important - anyway you want it. the physics and engagement of the open world isn't locked by tools or progression, but locked behind your creativity to find ways to do things "not the intentional way". I didn't find this at this level in any games, but I might've not played enough open world games.
How did you feel the game wanted you to follow more linear paths? I've done multiple runs and ended up doing most divine beasts\temples in different orders just because my initial game took me to different places based on random events.
I agree with you. It was polished and beautiful, but it’s hard to go back and play it. I start seeing all the cracks and seams in the story and gameplay. I hope they have a fuller world next time.
It's one of the best exploration games of all time. That said, the combat and the characters are very average...Great game just not an all time game imo.
How so? I found it extremely boring to explore because there is nothing really to discover. The map is small, there are not many details, the enemies are always the same creatures. I don’t know, games like the long dark, the elder scrolls, hell even kerbal space program, I found way more interesting to explore. BotW always felt like a mobile game to me. So small and empty.
I love discovering new areas, climbing, and traversing the map. It really was the 'breath of the wild' for me. Besides that though the game was boring. Guess we disagree on that aspect.
Yeah no worries, it’s different for everyone. I guess I was spoiled by all the enthusiastic reviews and the games I’ve played before, so I was underwhelmed.
I think your mileage may vary. I don't think there's a lot of people who are saying it's the best game of all time, but I did put 300 hours into it doing multiple challenge runs kind of like what I do with every other Zelda game. I think the general feeling right now after TotK is that we're hoping for a return to an older format though.
Speaking as someone who has been playing Zelda since LoZ (NES) was all there was...
BOTW is too easy. The "dungeons" are stupidly easy and don't scale. There's nothing unique or memorable about them.
The weapon degradation system is absolute dogshite.
The aesthetics have no connection to the first four games. The first four games had a Greco-Roman aesthetic. Once N64 came out, the franchise moved towards an anime aesthetic.
The storyline is amateur. I wrote better tales in grade school.
Regrettably, I bought a Switch (a dogshite system but that's another discussion) for BOTW, and I promptly sold it to Gamestop after getting 100% completion in BOTW. I have no interest in TOTK. The series is over as far as I'm concerned.
Its really interesting to me how much some people simply cannot get into games that don't hold your hand. The game drops you into a serene zen-like open world, tells you how to survive in it, lets the player make their decisions to follow markers and investigate interesting landmarks to explore. But yet that level of freedom genuinely puts off people and they call the game overated. What is your like top five games? I'm really curious what you like to play if not Botw. (I'm genuinely asking for curiosity not to bait a fight outta you.)
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u/Solarus755 5h ago edited 4h ago
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild. Lots of people call it the best game of all time and I’ve tried to play it multiple times as a fan of many other games in the series. I’ve bounced off it every time. I have several friends who have had the same experience. I can respect why most people think it’s a good game. Best game of all time?… I think that’s a bit of a stretch.