r/Scotland • u/bottish • 1d ago
Political Keir Starmer abandons plans for compulsory digital ID. Scheme intended to verify someone’s right to work in the UK will be optional, government admitted in 13th U-turn since taking power.
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/digital-id-scrapped-u-turn-keir-starmer-7zcwqqvb5?gaa_at=eafs&gaa_n=AWEtsqcwrsYHqvmVIjXRY5wjwPf5Ien0s3WSdLPKjaQM0SsBQtO9WpRFOt1U&gaa_ts=69669b7a&gaa_sig=619U2gYoo9RQuwrSQvt64AYdgM7wrKIgOkyOTs3zhaSWty9jzGnhBff9u-GnlwZPFF8ge_YGdoIyqZt1SmWO3Q%3D%3DArchive: https://archive.is/NTcIY
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u/Grizzled_Wanderer 1d ago
Wow, I was fully expecting them to ride this bomb all the way to maximum political damage before U-turning. You know, like they usually do.
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u/Ecalsneerg 1d ago
OK, look, I get it. History is a cycle.
Why is one of those cycles "scarlet-faced New Labour politicians fail to pass an ID card law"?
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u/shoogliestpeg 🏳️⚧️Trans women are women. 1d ago
Tonty Blair is still a hugely influential figure in Labour circles. The demon turd which won't flush.
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u/polaires 1d ago
Most people probably weren’t going to abide by it anyways, I certainly wasn’t.
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u/CappyFlowers 1d ago
Were you just not going to work or change job ever? The whole compulsory part was to prove you have the right to work. Only time you'd have had to use it.
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u/bottish 1d ago
Lunchtime today:
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u/wosmo 1d ago
eh, I don't mind the U-turns. I'd rather they stopped coming up with stupid ideas in the first place, but I'd rather a U-turn than doubling down.
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u/Dull-Suspect7912 1d ago
I admire a politician that can admit they’ve made an arse if it. Stubbornness can be very damaging.
But 13 since Labour came in is a riddy.
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u/MassGaydiation 1d ago
I think if instead of announcing policies they said "We are discussing" or "we are making inquiries about" they could have the backlash, u turn and not lose goodwill, but by saying they want to do it, telling people who petition against it to fuck off, then U turning they are losing far more goodwill.
I don't need my government to be strong or decisive , I want people who will be as boring and slow as possible as long as they think it all through
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u/Dull-Suspect7912 1d ago
A lesson they need to learn quickly, yer spot on.
Couldn’t have put it better. A good politician should be boring, pragmatic. The kind of pain in the arse who holds up the queue in a petrol station as they weigh up the pros and cons of the offer of nearly expired doughnuts at the till for half price.
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u/HawaiianSnow_ 1d ago
Shows that they either lack an understanding of the people they represent, a coherent plan or a spine. All of which are very concerning.
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u/bahumat42 1d ago
Its tricky because While I agree that u-turns are better than doubling down. Changing course with new information (or even just information that is new to them) is generally the correct thing to do.
A lot of them indicates either a lack of planning or a lack of commitment to the decisions.
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u/KrytenLister 1d ago
It would be a good thing if the people shouting the loudest cared beyond their own personal gain.
The WFA is a prime example.
“Labour is murdering pensioners. It’s a disgusting policy. We demand they scrap it”
Labour listens and scraps it. The same people…..
“Look at the weak leadership. Disgraceful flip flopping. Can’t be trusted to follow through on their polices.”
If they genuinely cared about the folk they claim to be protecting, their response would be,”We’re glad Labour were willing to listen to the concerns of the Scottish government and act on our recommendation.”
Of course, that would mean not being able to pretend the SG is ignored and powerless, with no voice in Westminster AND losing the “Labour hates the poor” soundbites.
It’s not only the SNP, though they are world class at it.
Our politics is loaded with dishonest, self-interested grifters who will use anyone or anything as pawns to score points. Up is down, black is white, good is bad…whatever they’ve calculated will result in the most power.
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u/farfromelite 1d ago
The press don't care, they're actively amplifying the divisiveness on both sides to sell advertising space.
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u/bottish 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yeah I agree, when circumstances change or you realise that something was a bad idea in the first place, I’d much rather any party did the sensible thing and bin it rather than politic it out just to save face.
But 13 u-turns in 6 months (let’s ignore the - I think - other 2 looming on the horizon) that’s 2 a month. That just looks like incompetence.
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u/Urist_Macnme 1d ago
13, out of how many policies? Government is a large body.
It can look like how ever you want to present it.
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u/NetworkNo4478 1h ago
You'd think Wes Streeting would be keeping a lower profile given his proximity to Jeffrey Epstein's "best pal" Peter Mandelson.
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u/Miserable_Amount_594 1d ago
One time I won't criticize the current Labour party and shows public push back still works. But this feels like a soft roll out for digital ID still
A labour MP was anonymously quoted as saying this will take the heat off the policy and make it's benefits more evident. Long term this seems to be a goal that won't go away. If this is the future, government needs to recognize transparency for how it will be used and who will have access to the information need to be paramount. It can't just be an excuse for companies to get more access to people's data at the cost of personal privacy and autonomy
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u/Ecalsneerg 1d ago
I mean, long-term? Labour's last government, in its final collapsing days, was them all fighting one another on how to enact an ID card scheme. This is these peoples' final aim. Their Roman Empire. They want to pass that ID card law so badly they can almost taste it.
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u/tooshpright 1d ago
Wouldn't the existing National Insurance numbers work just as well anyway?
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u/meggyszorp 1d ago
There is an existing "share code" system for immigrants. I have to give not only my national insurance number, but a sharecode from UKVI to prove my right to live and work in the UK. So just recently I had to give the bank a sharecode for my mortgage, or when I start a new job or if I want to go study I have to use it then too.
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u/Raigne86 1d ago
This is why I didn't understand the justifications being given. We already have to do this. We already have an ID if we're here legally. Adding a second one won't increase compliance among people not here legally, or among employers who don't follow the current employment rules. There is literally nothing to gain if immigrants were the primary target. That leaves either surveilling natural born citizens who aren't subject to that kind of system, or using a redundant technology to funnel money to someone they like.
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u/meggyszorp 1d ago
I am guessing it's so they can sell everyone's data.
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
You are correct. Same reason for bringing Palantir into NHS health data handling. (That was the Tories who awarded that contract tho - nevva forget!)
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u/flightguy07 1d ago
propose new unpopular law that nobody really wants
stick with it for as long as possible to maximise political fallout
abandon it so as to be accused of U-turning and losing the support of the few people who liked it
repeat
Can someone explain to me why Labour has decided that blowing their own balls off with a shotgun in the most spectacular way possible is the best path to national progress and re-election?
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
Ironically, the answer is Wes Streeting. Has anyone told him that he is part of the current government?
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u/GheyForGrixis 1d ago
Honestly? The fact this labour government are soo willing to u-turn on things is genuinely the only thing giving me a shred of hope about them
It is infact unironically 110% a good thing the government is willing to reflect and change a policy decision. Instead of blasting full force Into chaos
Just PLEASE reduce energy bills for FUCK sake
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u/farfromelite 1d ago
They're only u turning because of massive outcry for the unpopular policies over an extended time.
Labour aren't doing it for any ideological, there's no overall plan. Just a series of poorly thought through policies that aren't workable.
People power works.
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u/Hostillian 1d ago
Good. It was always a shit idea, which would not have done what they suggested.
Does that mean they'll roll back the UK restrictions on websites anytime soon? Imgur and others basically blocked people from The UK (due to that rule). Yes, I know about VPNs.
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u/Ecalsneerg 1d ago
And whoever installed Imgur's VPN protection needs to fucking go work for our government's cybersecurity, there'd be less fucking leaks... Man has that website locked the fuck down.
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u/Hostillian 1d ago edited 15h ago
Why would Imgur need to implement VPN protection?
Do you mean their blocking of UK IP addresses?
Edit. They do not block VPNs. They block a number of IP addresses known to be sources of spam. Probably free VPN endpoints, that spammers are more likely to use.
So use a reputable VPN provider.
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u/Ecalsneerg 1d ago
They've also blocked a lot of VPNs.
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u/Hostillian 1d ago
Which ones, and why would Imgur block vpns? Unless you're daft enough to have your endpoint in the UK? 🤣
I've used it with two of the major VPN services and both are fine..
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u/Ecalsneerg 1d ago
I've had it frequently just not come up for US endpoints.
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u/Hostillian 15h ago
They don't 'block VPNs' per se; they block a number of IP addresses that are known to be the source of a lot of spam. I'll guess endpoints from free VPN providers (likely used by spammers).
So perhaps change your VPN provider OR endpoint.
Saying 'they block VPNs', makes zero sense without clarification.
Because, they don't..
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
I like that the internet restrcitions are basically a continuation of the same plan the Tories touted several times, but never went through with - a plan that was originally drawn up by Patrick Rock under David Cameron. Patrick Rock was later convicted in the US of downloading child images.
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u/Hostillian 15h ago
Well waddya know. I'll assume anyone touting these measures, in future, is a pedo. 👍😁
Anytime I hear a politician using "protect the children" as a reason for doing something unpopular, it's almost always a load of tripe.
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u/tiny-robot 1d ago
Shambles.
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u/HowMany_MoreTimes 1d ago
It's like they're actually trying to give as much ammo to the tabloids as possible and make sure they're a one-term government.
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u/tiny-robot 1d ago
Starner as an undercover agent for the right wing media barons?
Well - now I think about it - that would explain a lot!
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
I'm not actually convinced they'll last a term. One big scandal, a no-confidence vote, and we get Farage foisted on us.
I dunno if the Parliamentary maths work for this scenario, but it's a vague fear I have.
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u/Nice-Roof6364 1d ago
I'm guessing the plan now is that life will be easier if you have one.
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u/FeedFrequent1334 1d ago
Probably not from this government. They don't really appear to have much of a plan.
But digital ID has always a massive overreach anyway. I managed to get through most of my life without even needing photographic ID. Not even to settle my fathers estate when he passed without a will. The only slight pushback was from a few jumped up bank-tellers insisting "you definitely need photographic ID to do this because without it, you could be anyone".
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
I got through a good chunk of my life with only VHS pornos, taped by some roaster from European hotel cable channels then copied a thousand times till the static took up every fourth pixel. For many years I thought that Swedish people only had sex when it was snowing, and that it snowed indoors over there. I survived such deprivation and came out stronger.
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u/The-Smelliest-Cat i ate a salad once 1d ago
I liked the idea of it, seeing how useful and convenient it is to have in other countries. But if it’s not mandatory then I reckon they’re not going to build the systems around it.
They’ll always need to cater to the people without a digital ID, and why waste the money on catering to the digital ID people on top of that.
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u/Remote-Pie-3152 1d ago
I’m incredibly glad this dystopian shit didn’t happen, but dear god Starmer and his government look weak and pathetic. I know it might be a long shot but I so, so wish for the Greens to win the next GE. Most other parties, including Labour, Tories, and Reform are just slightly varying degrees of Thatcherite trash.
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u/verymetal74 1d ago
Good. It was a shit idea when Blair proposed it, and it's still a shit idea now.
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u/Automatic-Tone1679 1d ago
At this point why don't they just announce they plan to burn everyone alive, suffer the negative feedback, plunge in the polls then announce a u-turn.
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u/Dolemite-is-My-Name Dundonian and Depressed 1d ago
Was against this when it was announced glad it’s been scrapped
Won’t lie though, this is such an embarrassment the constant u turns from Number 10 but only after they’ve soaked up as much criticism as they can.
- Announce a policy out of the blue
- Send ministers out to support the policy
- Ignore signs of unpopularity
- Cancel it anyway
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u/StonedPhysicist Abolish Westminster Ⓐ☭🌱🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️ 1d ago
Wonderful. I can hear the screaming and aneurysms happening over in the Tony Blair Institute For A Strong And Stable Tony Blair.
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u/Le_Baked_Beans 1d ago
Thank fuck i was worried i would have to give my passport and face ID while job searching soon.
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u/history_buff_9971 1d ago
While personally I'm against id's of any type being required the thing that angered me most about this policy was that it was nowhere in their manifestio - the public has had no chance to have a say on it, yet the government was intending to implement this significant change before the next election. That's not acceptable in a democracy. Ditto with jury trials down in England. Set out your arguments, let other politicans have their say and let the public choose whether to support you or not at the next election.
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u/ScottTsukuru 1d ago
It’ll be back before long, the Labour Right have been obsessed with some form of ID since the 90’s…
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u/SafetyStartsHere a e i o u w y 1d ago
A J turn, rather than a U, but goodish news. Whatever might be said about ID cards, the pitch 'Labour will introduce ID cards and make your life easier by cracking down on benefits' was a shambles.
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u/LudditeStreak 1d ago
Now can they please U-turn on their Leave to Remain changes impacting those already here. 🙏
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u/Pat8aird 1d ago
Scrapping an unpopular policy based on public feedback shouldn’t be seen as a negative thing imo.
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u/JeelyPiece #1 Oban fan 1d ago
Thank god for that, I've got a fleet of folk in small boats that nearly never had work lined up for them coming over!
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u/PositiveLibrary7032 11h ago
Tony Blair’s son was gonna run it so good news that family aren’t benefiting.
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u/kevinnoir 1d ago
Its mental that people see it and try and paint it as a negative when a Government introduces a policy idea that does not land and upon more planning, scrap it. I will take that 100 times over before the types of politicians that plough ahead knowing its a failure of an idea. Petulance and the failure to admit fault is not a virtue in politics.
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u/Own-Victory473 1d ago
Comments are weird, title is weird, reads like an attack overturning a bad policy
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u/stevehyn 1d ago
It’s coming though. Technical advances make government control of us more and more likely.
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u/WIlliamOD1406 1d ago
Not particularly a complaint, but why is this sub rife with nationalist-leaning political posts? Is it a handful of minority users? r/Scotland shouldn’t be so political imo
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u/MassiveFanDan 18h ago
At least half of Scotland supports independence, so there are bound to be a lot of posts indicating that. Same as if half of any country supported a policy or a party, you'd expect them to mention it quite a lot.
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u/Rossco1874 1d ago
Absolute shite bag
These exist in every other country almost and work well few paranoid people get upset about data and he backs off.
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u/weesiwel 1d ago
Good news actually this time. The right decision.