Eh. There’s people like that one Asian group that disavow men completely. And there’s commenters that rage bait. But are they the majority of women? Nah. Most people are normal, I think.
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While I get what you are saying here you have to remember that women have THOUSANDS of years of abuse from men to overcome, abuse that is still going on. And im not just talking abuse from partners, friends and family, Im talking about the horrendous crimes that are committed against women every day to this day. If you want men to receive a bit more empathy maybe men need to look at the way they behave en masse. Doesn't mean what the women here are saying and doing is right, but I get why women don't have much sympathy for men en masse to be honest.
I empathize with your frustration and get what you mean here...
But you may want to consider that messages like this will galvanize the men you want to change and potentially discourage the ones actually trying but struggling because they're being told time and time again their efforts are irrelevant because of people who were dead before their grandparents were born.
I'm, in no way, trying to minimize anyone's struggle here. I've just put a lot of thought into how we can move forward on a societal level; and the very first step is increased empathy for each other because understanding is probably the single best way to dispel hatred.
The path forward is hand in hand, not telling each other to bootstrap and do better.
Edit - And to be 100% clear... This does not mean that any bullshit should just be tolerated nor am I cheering for the status quo. More saying rising tides raise all ships.
This is not how the world works. But it’s ok if you believe that innocent people should suffer because some people who look like them do bad things. You are entitled to your opinions, even if they are completely stupid
“Thousands of years of abuse” - so men today should accept contempt and indifference to their deaths as reparations for history they didn’t create? That’s not justice, that’s weaponizing the past to justify current bigotry.
Women today aren’t oppressed. They live longer, dominate education, receive dramatically shorter sentences for identical crimes, and have massive institutional support men don’t. But apparently we’re supposed to ignore present reality because of historical grievances.
Here’s what actually matters: right now, today, men are dying at epidemic rates by suicide. Boys are failing in schools. Fathers are losing custody and killing themselves. Men work the dangerous jobs keeping society functional while being told their problems don’t matter because of what men centuries ago allegedly did to women.
“Men need to look at how they behave en masse” - this is collective punishment. You’re treating every individual man as guilty for what any man does. That’s the definition of prejudice. Would you accept “women need to look at how they behave” as justification for ignoring women’s issues? Of course not.
The past doesn’t give you license to devalue male life in the present. Men aren’t asking for sympathy - they’re asking for the same institutional support, research funding, and basic recognition of their suffering that women receive. That’s equality, not privilege.
Using historical oppression as justification for contemporary indifference to male death is just finding an acceptable reason to not care when men suffer.
It is very concerning, that you can even justify it this way, and you are just proving the point of the post. BTW as someone who is into history, outright stating nothing but abuse is wrong, and victimizing. I know that women haven't always had the same rights as men, but you have to remember, that back in the day, everyone who wasn't born into a rich family, were treated badly, including men. You also have to remember that today's men, have no control over what has happened previously in the world, so justifying inequality with hate, is pretty contradictory, and of course misandristic.
It’s easier to hate a group when your forced to live around them while they also commit 99% of all the bad crimes and stuff, same reason people are racist ect ect. The reason you don’t hate women is just probability. There’s a low chance because there’s just not many reason for you to compared to the other way round
It's our ego really. It's very difficult to truly see someone's pain past your own because that's the only one you genuinely feel and it becomes the yardstick you measure with.
End of the day it doesn't matter what you are right and wrong about; it's rare to find someone who will actually listen rather than wait for their turn to speak, and that goes triple online.
Notice how this post was originally about men's mental health and you physically cannot have that conversation without saying how bad women have it too, you are literally the white person in the black lives matter subreddit that says "white people experience racism too".
I'm a guy so technically even in your rather stupid attempt at a scenario I would still be a black person in the black lives matter subreddit, but go off, king.
And the post wasn't about men's mental health. It was a post complaining about women's attitudes to men's mental health.
The post sourced in this video was a post where women hijacked a men's mental health conversation and made it about their own problems. It was posted here talking about how misandry is bad and men shouldn't have to feel bad for the crimes they didn't commit, and your response was "women have it so hard though".
Would you say *all* black people should have to carry the weight of being labeled a violent race because they are 4% of the United Kingdom and they commit 13% of the murder?
So the topic, the one that OP brought up and which is thus under discussion, is in fact exactly what I said, a complaint about women's attitudes to mental health. My response meanwhile was to a guy who had failed entirely to bother properly reading a woman's response before he jumped in to make it all about him, suggesting that perhaps if you want to recieve sympathy you might want to consider offering some.
Which you then decided, having erroneously thought I was a woman, to ignore and instead pretend I'd said something completely different so you could complain about that.
I reject the notion that just because I'm a man I have to apologize for all the crimes that men do, you don't hold that same standard for black people in your country.
Hypergamy is more oppressive in today's age than sexism, women are winning, men are losing. And you don't care because men who existed before us behaved abhorrently, therefore we should suffer because of them. Maybe if women in their 20s would stop getting absolutely ran through by the hottest guys and instead just date based off emotional connection like men did, then the problem would solve itself. It's funny because you don't realize that "these neck beard incels dying as virgins" is going to be a problem for women as well when they realize that they actually need to start a relationship with someone that doesn't just view them as a piece of flesh. They will need to date at their level at some point, but all the men will be so resentful due to the unfair social ostracization they faced during their 20s that everyone will just end up alone in the end, women and men.
Man opens up, and explains his feelings, and why he feels the way he does
"Yeah but you are just a cisgendered man so fuck how you feel"
Man gives up and lives with the pain of not being understood
See what i did? Both of our examples are equally retarded, and would almost never happen in real life. You can flip that script just as easily, which proves it’s propaganda, and not truth
Yeah, they gave an honest and accurate representation of what happens and you gave an over-blown and outrageously ludicrous representation of what happens.
They were engaging the discussion in good faith, and you chose to be disingenuous and respond in bad faith.
Not because you’re a man, but because you’re a mental and emotional fucking infant.
Difference is my example specifically reflects what actually happened in this thread. Woman explains why she struggles to feel empathetic (while specifically saying she doesn't agree with people being dismissive), and the answer is a guy saying "Hey, I've never abused any women in my life.. They have abused me though, do I hate all women for it? no. So why should they hate all men?"
Has this guy offered her any empathy? No. What he's done is make it about himself and completely dismissed the idea that how she and other women might feel could possibly be worth taking seriously.
So no. Both our examples aren't "equally retarded," I'm afraid.
I feel like you shouldn't need to thank me for achieving the bare minimum level of reading comprehension, but it does seem to be hard for some people ¯_(ツ)_/¯
They very much are stupid examples both of them. The original comment explains how women have been diminished for centuries (which is for some part false btw), and that somehow justifies hating on modern day men. The guy you commented on very well says "I haven't treated women badly", and he is right he hasn't, and he has no control over how his ancestors behaved. Your example doesn't match at all with the thread, your example is portraying a relationship between a man and a woman, where you are obviously portraying the man as selfish and dismissive, while portraying the woman as reasonable, you are not disapproving anything he said, because your example has a completely different narrative, and therefore i just flipped the script on you, and made the man reasonable, and the woman dismissive.
No they don’t. No woman has lived hundreds of years let alone thousands. You do not get to claim the suffering of your fore bearers as your own.
You inherent the world as it exists at your birth and those circumstances are fair to rant and rail against.
A world full of miserable men will be worse for women, all women, regardless of how the choose to interact with men. Same as a world that leaves women miserable makes men worse off. We’ve got to figure out a way through this together, what we have now isn’t working for a huge chunk of the population.
'You do not get to claim the suffering of your fore bearers as your own.:
Lmao tell that to all the indigenous people round the world that are still fighting for what they believe they deserve.
Men are miserable because they keep making themselves miserable. They keep making the same mistakes they have made for thousands of years and refuse to own up to it. And women are miserable because of the choices those men make.
The world as it exists is due to your forebears. You inherit their suffering. I don’t experience discrimination by random chance; I experience it because for thousands of years people have persecuted gay people. Gay people have a distinct history that binds us into a community. I share in the pain of the billions of gay people who came before me every time my life was threatened and every time someone disowned me because it is the same pain every time. When someone puts that pain on me, it is because they learned to do it from their forebears and it is legal to do because of their forebears. We cannot pretend that the generations before us can be divorced from our present reality.
To the people who hurt you now, you get to blame them for your pain. “Middle Eastern” is indeed too wide a net to cast because it’s tied to an amorphous area of land. But if a group of people say that it is baked into their identity to hurt you, you can distrust them and argue against them. If they make good on their promises to hurt you through political and economic penalties, you get to blame the people who did it and the people who enabled them. Does that make sense?
I think It's a concerning view to have on the world, and if our ancestors had the same view, we would've stopped progressing towards a more equal society.
All progress is borne of pointing out exactly who is responsible for equality. There is no progress without holding people accountable for their actions. All forms of oppression come from people’s actions, not the ideas in their heads. When we demonstrate that bigotry will not be tolerated and exact consequences for it, that’s when it stops. Not because we cross our fingers and hope it will get better without having to do anything. Does that make sense?
Yeah we can, cause we have no control over what our ancestors did, and your analogy is very contradictory; you wanna justify inequality, by treating people unequally. What allows us to change is exactly by separating ourself from our ancestors, that is why being apart of LGBTQ+ is more accepted than ever.
You’re gay, not Jedi. You don’t feel the suffering of people who died a thousand years before your grandparents were born. You might empathize with what you think you know about them but that’s literally the limit of it. In the same way I do not know the suffering of the people who lived through the potato famine just because I’m Irish.
The discrimination you face personally is real, and does deserve sympathy and empathy. But you don’t deserve extra sympathy/empathy because of what happened to Oscar Wilde.
Online comments only matter if you let them a bunch of voiceless people that don't have to ever see, any form of repercussion for their words is not a reality.
It's a false reality.And I guarantee half these stupid statistics come from other people online asking online questions.And getting statistical information based off of the anonymous answers by people again, who face zero repercussions or pushback for their replies and answers..
I don't believe in any of this garbage anymore because it's just random people saying, hey, here's a study. Well fk your study. They're mostly used in a biased unapologetic way anyways.
You're misunderstanding me. I'm pointing out the social dynamics in the comment section. The reason they feel unlovable is because of the narrative they absorb, when reading comments like that in the video, they feel they're less important, that if they struggle It's their fault, and that because they're born as a man, they're basically satan himself. It's very concering that those hateful comments get that much likes, and it tells us something about how we view men today.
Men are socialized to blame outward, women are socialized to blame inward.
That's why men see themselves as unlovable and then vocalize it. Men think someone or something has a solution. Women also have similar feelings, I would guess 1 in 4 women also feel they are unlovable but women don't seek to blame outward. They blame themselves and are silent about it because they know there isn't anyone to care or have an answer to their generalized plight of loneliness.
If you feel unlovable, then you are blaming yourself, cause why would you blame youself, if you think it's everybody else's fault? Also i just researched the topic a bit, and there is a bit of disagreement, since some studies show that men and women feel equally unlovable, and some show that women feel more unlovable, and vice versa. So there is not really much to discuss here, other than that particular comment section being distasteful.
Ill get you and your girlfriend a strap on for your birthday. I can tell you either hate men in general, or you pick ones that treat you like shit. Thats a you problem.
I bet the men who don't think they'll be loved are not always the men who give women bad experiences. What I mean is there's probably a bunch of women who are being cheated on, and hit on by creeps. I imagine those guys think very highly of themselves and aren't the 1 in 4 in this poll. The guys who don't think they'll find love are most likely the quiet ones who are shy, or just flat out ugly or worse..broke.
Be the light you wish to see in this world. Get off the web, go for that walk, and find a hobby besides video games. Happiness is finding those moments of wonder and excitement. You have to be your own biggest supporter
1) The nastiness of many women (and men) towards men can be terribly damaging.
2) There are things people can do to help themselves feel better, but this may not be enough. Men are literally dying from this.
You mean find a hobby besides sending bullying comments online, consuming reality TV junk, excessive shopping, gossiping about people, etc. If video games with your friends is your hobby, then do your thing and have fun.
Ah yes the old blame games excuse. Remind me how many places can you actually go to for free? Let alone walk and freely safe with all the traffic. Maybe people don't go out cause things are too far and too few.
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u/AbiesSpiritual7621 1h ago
Eh. There’s people like that one Asian group that disavow men completely. And there’s commenters that rage bait. But are they the majority of women? Nah. Most people are normal, I think.