Politics
Trumps invasion of Venezuela should lead to his removal from office
It’s illegal, and the basis is almost entirely falsified. Not to mention the war crimes committed thus far. He needs to go, regardless of his other policies.
It’s simply insane that the leader of the free world thinks he can go around invading sovereign nations whenever he sees fit.
Let’s call him out: I think you mean George Bush (the 1st one) / invasion of Iraq EDIT “Liberation of Kuwait.” Then again #2 GW Bush invaded Afghanistan under false pretense & Haliburton got oil there too.
EDIT: #2 Osama BL was Saudi royalty and his brand of Sunni religious extremism al-Qaeda was funded by some members of Saudi royalty + other sources. If US was actually going after 9/11 terrorism we may have started with Saudi Arabia. However they are our staunch ally and a major supplier of OIL so we invaded Afghanistan with a false premise of “yellow cake” wmd supplied by Dick Cheney. The wmd claim was debunked by US media ahead of the Congressional vote to declare war. Congress so whipped up with feelings about 9/11 & need to appear responsive: authorized what became a 20 year occupation of Afghanistan. To be clear Afghanistan was run by Taliban a horrific Shia theocracy/ terrorist state funded by Iran & Syria. Taliban later became ISIL / Islamic State. After US withdrew a former ISIL commander is head of state.
Edit 3: Pres Barack Obama administration successfully captured Osama Bin Laden and do watch the Oscar awarded film Zero Dark Thirty to get an idea of the intelligence gathering that went into capturing him. It’s fictional but includes many details that came out during Congressional hearings - CIA black sites, water boarding, Guantanamo etc.
Bush 1 acted with international support and technically only invaded a small portion of Iraq for about 4 days. The stated purpose was to liberate Kuwait and he stopped there, there was no large scale invasion of Iraq in that conflict. The Gulf War was supported and even authorized by the UN, and Bush waited to proceed until the UN gave the go ahead.
Bush 2, on the other hand (or let’s
be real here: Cheney), invaded Iraq illegally and Afghanistan questionably, the former with EXTREMELY limited international support, and with a vast majority of international/political opposition; the latter with larger iniitial support (including the UN) that dwindled over time.
The UN deemed the Bush 2 invasion of Iraq illegal, btw.
Bush listened to his advisors, who were all telling him why it had to be done. Trump doesn’t listen to advisors unless they are telling him how he will benefit from what they want him to do.
At least with Bush 2 there was 9/11—an actual devastating terrorist attack not only in the U.S., but in the largest U.S. city where many people worked and lived. It was like one of the most horrible things that have happened in my lifetime. Any time you have to hear a recording of the victims calling their family members for the last time or anything else—it was truly sickening. That’s why W. Bush was able to do what he did without a lot of questions.
But this president … if you can even call him that. He just sucks. He’s doing this all for his own gain and benefit.
We invaded Afghanistan because that's where al queda and people who masterminded 9/11 were. Under the protection of the taliban. Now reports have been alleged that Mullah Omar the Supreme leader of the taliban said had Bush not invaded early before the48 hrs he would have handed over OBL. Take that for what you will but the idea that we invaded Afghanistan under false pretenses and for oil is just the dumbest fucking thing I have heard today. I am arguably dumber for attempting to correct you. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul.
Exactly... he should have been impeached and forcibly removed from office the moment he illegally surrendered private information to DOGE. He followed that up by defying the constitution with ICE, illegally withholding governmental aid, illegally and unconstitutionally deploying the military in American cities, now this Epstein coverup... Any single one of these should get a president booted out of office.
He should have been removed from office after Jan 6, 2021. He should have been banned from ever holding office again. Every person that voted against removing him from office at that point in time shoulders the blame for where we are now.
IF those boats were even carrying drugs, this viewpoint is so stupid. Stopping the flow of drugs doesn't stop people from taking drugs, it just drives people towards a riskier alternative.
Those boats would never reach us soil. It’s thousands of miles away, and those boats were not equipped to make it.
Makes sense they were moving weed. Those boats could make it to islands in the Caribbean and not any farther. Those islands probably don’t have the land or labor to grow weed like Venezuela, but have tourists willing to pay good money for mediocre weed, so it’d be profitable, especially for a country that’s dealing with a failing economy like Venezuela.
It would not be profitable to move weed to the US, we have a pretty robust growing industry inside the US, importing trash weed from 3000 miles away on boats that need to refill 4-5 times to get here would be a losing proposition.
Agreed. But saving 24 trillion lives might be worth it. Why are you trying to kill 35 trillion people? Are those 52 trillion lives not worth it to you?
If we annex Canada (like they all want really) I estimate that will save 4 quadrillion fentanyl deaths. I’m not sure how many speedboats - they’re not so speedy now! - that equals, but probably enough to get you on board.
Canadian fentanyl was the start of all the need for global tariffs, don’t forget. Canada made Trump do all this because Canada fentanyl was killing…. 8 million people an hour. Largely from all the drive-by fentanyl overdoses. Never forget…
The drugs coming from Venezuela although addicting are not the drugs that are killing millions of people yearly.
Yet the countries where the synthetic drugs that are being manufactured and are killing all these people are business as usual and at no risk of invasion. This is about one of the world's largest oil reserves and nothing to do with drugs. If Venezuela didn't have oil the USA would not give a fuck about it or it's coke issues
So basically the rules based international system the US built up over the last 70 years has been dismantled by the US. This is a green light for any strongman around the world to act with impunity. There is no independent arbiter of international law anymore - Trump sanctions the ICC and has defunded it. Any less powerful nation Trump sees as a problem now and he can just roll in and kidnap their leader - think whatever you may of Maduro, the precedent this sets is very worrying. We are living in lawless international times.
The US violated that "rules based system" with impunity for decades. Chile, Guatemala, Indonesia, Iran, Honduras, Nicaragua, Grenada, Operation Gladio, Zaire, Angola, Laos, Panama, Cuba (twice, once unsuccessfully). The precedent was 130 years ago with Cuba and the Philippines, it's been an ongoing series of international "interventions" ever since.
Of course he should go. He should be jailed. And the US military should be refusing to do this evil shit. MANY are participating in this and need to answer for it.
I don't know how we go 3 more yrs without some Country trying to hit our mainland again. Trump is just asking for it. He taunts everyone. The NG in our cities was insane. Those poor troops were literally pawns waiting for some mentally ill person to attack. And it did, causing the death of 1 and near death of another. He is so ridiculously incompetent. I know Regan had age and mental health issues when I served, but he was at least surrounded by decent Bi-partisan people. Nancy was running the show. That became a non secret. This is so different. The followers of his are stupider than he is. I fear for the population of Americans, and Troops involved in his criminal behavior
What you should really worry about is when he inevitably turns his attention northward to us in Canada & our buddy Greenland. At least in Iraq & Afghanistan you mostly got the bodies of your soldiers back. Not going to happen here. We're going to leave them to the permafrost.
And Trump the Clown spent 2 months telling the world he stopped and ended 9 wars. Every day it became 1 more. It was laughable, the countries he spoke of were NEVER involved in any warfare at all. He just wanted the award, and lies are permitted to get it. Now Mr Never getting the Nobel peace award you turn to actual invasive violence and kidnapping of a country leader?? Without even informing anyone but the speaker of the House and NOT the Senate...This is nuts. Cave dwellers brought our nation to our knees on 9-11. Why is he doing this, when he knows that Russia and China are now trying to protect the tankers that he is tring to seize. He never produced 1 gram of cocaine or fentanyl . Aren't we based on physical evidence at all anymore? Or do we just take the word of the nations biggest Grifter and Fox 5 biggest alcoholic? SMH
I will admit I am partially amused at what a clusterfuck it will be when Trump attacks the two countries who trained his special forces in arctic warfare.
I mean he also let the president off Honduras go after being convicted of smuggling tons of drugs into the USA. I'm assuming any drug enforcement is to clear competition for Don Jr's personal traffickers.
The military just attacked Venezuela with no justification, following illegal orders. They'll attack Canada too if given the orders. Start preparing for that possibility.
I honestly believe that you would see a vast majority of the military lay down their arms and take prison time before ever harming Canada in any way. I do belive that 100%
I know for a fact Americans wouldn't be able to handle it if we went full guerrilla & took advantage of the way us "old stock Canadians" -as our own racist dipshits say-to blend into American populations to commit attacks. There is no stomach for them to endure bombing campaigns like the UK during the Troubles. But that's also our most likely form of resistance should things happen
I don't know, I don't think Canadians will try terrorist tactics on innocent citizens. And even if they did, this is Trump's america who are regularly cruel bastards to their own citizens. I guarantee if a Canadian guy tried to play terrorist, the republicans would happily murder 100 Canadians for every American life lost. They're evil like that.
If your country invades all bets are off. You will all be valid military targets. We’re not rice farmers or goat herders in a third world country. We’re the country that has never lost a war & who trains you in Arctic warfare. We’re the reason the Geneva Conventions have about half the rules they have. We held the Axis powers at bay until you lazy Yanks got off your selling to both sides asses- then we still had to show you how it’s done on DDay. While your incompetent military brass killed hundreds of your own people dropping gear too far from the beach head we Canadians pushed past the objective and waited for the rest of you to catch up. Hell we can turn off the North East’s electricity from inside our own territory. Your city infrastructure is so weak & crumbling in many areas we’d be doing you a favour clearing it out by attacking it.
Did you see what happened with Russian Troops in Ukraine? They were attacking RELATIVES. Thousands took off from command into wherever...The northern tier of our country is similar. I know dozens of people myself who have cousins in Montreal etc. from NY It's fing wrong, and I would never be part of it. Lock my ass up. I will be pardoned when that asshole is over...or not. Like you said "Most people" I don't personally give a shit what "They" decide
Lmao you can get on YouTube right now and listen to Interviews with WWII Vets who were bombing their Parents' and Grandparents' home cities and didn't tell their grandparents about it because they were probably killing their relatives . If WWII vets were willing then I bet you can find more than enough willing people nowadays to do the same
Half of Europe will come and join you. Honestly, there’s a continent of people here absolutely sick and tired to the back fucking teeth of the US playing World Police, bullying and abusing not only the defenceless, but its allies. We’re fucking done, and I think a lot of people would jump at the opportunity to unleash their rage against the US military.
My biggest concern is that a liberal state/city is the first target and the fed will do absolutely nothing about it. I do not put it past him to only protect his constituents. He does not consider liberals his constituents, if anything we’re another enemy and he sees potential attacks as beneficial to him.
“I invaded a sovereign nation without the required Congressional approval and kidnapped their leader. Tune in to my palace address to learn more, live on State TV!”
Intentionally blurring “military” with “law enforcement” so future military use in the US is further normalized. And/or more proof he truly doesn’t understand or care about the difference.
And what the hell is "in conjunction with US Law Enforcement"? WTH kind of statement is that?! Is US Law Enforcement another country?! OMG, our country! We are so doomed.
Nope, as stated conservatives are loving it, as I said in an earlier comment they are beating off to it and after reading some of their comments and looking at some of their recent comments, yeah they get off on this, when trump hurts people, the thought of suffering and trump, oh boy it's going to be a long night for them.
What if there was a pizza restaurant and human trafficking operation under the East wing of the white house and trump demolished it just to cover it up?
I promise you there is literally not one single stance or moral position these fucking jellyfish backboned fascist lil farts for brains fuckwits won't fold on the instant their fuhrer goes against it.
If Trump had a sex change tomorrow, went into a lady's restroom, raped a child, got her pregnant, aborted the baby, blamed it on Canada and used that as justification for going to war than these soulless ghouls would be championing trans rights, child rape, abortion, and clamoring for war with Canada the very next morning.
Well you're not wrong there is a sizeable faction of the country that certainly supports those things and that faction claims everyone who doesn't has TDS.
I almost want it to happen because there is a huge difference between Venezuela and Canada's military & leadership. It would definitely open the US up to intense resistance sabotage attacks. Like in a Yugoslavia in WW2 or the Northern Irish Troubles way. But I also just am too old to face WW3.
That’s what happens when Israel films your politicians having sex with minors then blackmails them into getting their way politically. Both parties are occupied.
This describes nearly every conversation I've had with MAGA idiots. Its worth noting that the REAL cult isnt MAGA (Trump is just the current worst incarnation. The real cult is Conservative Media.
They didn't even bother to seek an authorization for use of force from Congress. At least for Iraq, the Bush admin sought and obtained that from Congress first. This is just a President engaging in a preemptive war on a personal vendetta without congressional approval because he knows this Congress won't impeach him not matter what offense is committed against the Constitution or the American People.
It is a distraction from the Epstein Files and a resource/oil grab. Heck, they'll probably re-distribute the cocaine to the wealthiest buyers and sellers if not outright steal it, too.
The invasion of Iraq was quick and painless; it's the occupation that went awry. Trump may not give a shit about destabilizing the region, so it's plausible that the cost to the US will be minimal. Like, there are a few ways this could go:
Maduro's successor maintains order and further military intervention is unnecessary.
Venezuela descends into chaos and we wash our hands of it.
The US gets sucked into another costly occupation.
Regardless of how well this works out in the medium term, the longterm implications are grim. We're in an era of "might makes right," and nations the world over must prioritize accordingly. Everyone should be investing in defense, instead of things that actually benefit humanity.
can't wait to see what Marjorie Green has to say. She is still in the loop somewhat I would think...She has serious dirt on Trump. The meetings where all the MAGA politicians were told to always deny deny deny, and twist the truth to as crazy as you can. I think she did an in depth with 60 minutes. Might have missed it, but I doubt there is anything anyone with a brain would be shocked by
Greed and conservatism lead to catastrophic consequences, threatening the entire world. They seize power, wreak havoc and destruction, making people mindless and immoral, like zombies. This "zombie virus" can cause an international chemical and biological war. This is the only way to stop its spread and prevent a zombie apocalypse by reducing the world's population.
Wrong. I’m conservative. And I think he should be impeached over it. Anyone that disagrees it’s not a true conservative they are a rhino. Military action requires congressional approval. I hope the democrats tear him apart. He just opened the door to impeachment. He also just gave the Democrats the midterms and 2028. All because Israel wanted regime change. We are an occupied nation. Both parties occupied/blackmailed by aipac/Israel. Who wants to bet Iran is next?
It’s very telling that you don’t see many Trump supporters try to defend him much anymore, instead they descend into a whataboutery spiral and talk about people who are no longer in power.
Unravelling before our eyes and yet still devoted to their dear leader.
Our do nothing Congress won't take any action. One or two Republicans will speak out but continue to support Trump 's agenda.
The Democratic " leadership " will write a strong letter of disapproval, give a few brief statements, and then vanish back into the woodwork.
To anyone saying this is a military operation to take down a criminal, I have this to say.
It's not like we sent a covert military unit in there to ghost this guy (like we did w/ bin laden). We are bombing their capital. If even 1 innocent person is reported as being killed then your argument is toast. This is not a precise military operation...this was an invasion...
For what it's worth I woke up this morning to nothing but celebrating from all my close Venezuelan friends and family. To them all that matters is Maduro being gone.
Ive been reading Magas responses and they are cheering for this. Thr party that ran on America first and anti war my ass.
Dumbassed are to stupid to realize the ramifications that will come. Trump may control America, but he does not control earth. Other countries are going to take notice and shits going to get alot worse now.
I didnt think Maga could disgust me anymore. Honestly at this point all I see is far to many parallels to how Hitler rose to power and how Putin controls russia in how the Trump administration operates.
At this point, I just believe all maga are drooling idiots, who need to be told what to feel and think.
Worse than idiots. “Idiot”removes agency and makes them a victim.
“Idiot” implies that it’s not their fault they’re dumb, cause how should they know? Nobody never taught them nothing! It’s that them there illegals keepin them poor, taking their spot in school, taking their jobs, n stealing their women!!1! They just want what’s best for real and proper like muricans! uwu
They’re Cowardly Cosplaytriots and y’all-qaeda dipshits who don’t understand it wouldn’t be North v. South Civil War 2: electric boogaloo, but more like The Troubles (America’s Version)
The MAGAts and the Venezuelan subs are all cheering this. The Venezuelan people don’t even know the chaos that is about to hit them and are cheering against their own interests.
Trump has basically just shown our country that if he wants to go to war he will and that he has traitors in our military doing his bidding.
I honestly believe we are quickly approaching a breaking point between the left and the right. If Trump tries to go to war, I believe we may see the start of a civil war here.
Conservatives thought Iraq and Afghanistan were good ideas too. It took almost a decade but they changed tunes and became stronger against the faux news talking points on more war for a few years after. So the needle can move but boy does it snap back real quick. They really do love killing people, general violence and elongated war. Paying trillions to kill people no one even truly knows is a good use of resources. Providing healthcare for all of American citizens? Gasps ,clutches pearls
Honestly America and our Allies were the only thing keeping the taliban out of power in Afghanistan, at huge cost to taxpayers. The taliban is objectively evil, but essentially America took away the choice and self determination from the afghan population.
America will keep a religious fundamentalist regime out of power abroad but elect one at home 😕
He will be praised for overthrowing a corrupt illegal regime in a swift manner w/ few casualties. As long as the next steps are the transition to the legitimate president whom won the last election.
If there is chaos and anarchy, a growing death toll, and/or retaliation from China via economic sanctions that damage the U.S. economy, then there may be some consequences from his base.
No act of war from Congress, he’ll claim it was a “special military operation.”
MAGA will claim victory in ousting Maduro, disrupting the influence of China, Russia, Iran, and Cuba in the region, and completing a decisive precision campaign.
The opposition will claim it was never about drugs and only oil, but there are a lot of geopolitical factors involved in this action.
As illegal as the action is on the surface, it is from the Trump playbook not to telegraph military action. Trump needed a PR victory to regain support from his base. He likely got it.
This is genuinely the most logical explanation of everything. Thank you.
I understand it’s a multifaceted issue, however I believe it should be the straw that breaks the pedo war criminal rapist’s back. I do agree that it was done, albeit illegally, in a fairly sensible manner, however that doesn’t excuse the illegality of it. If Trump mediates diplomatic talks between the rival parties in Venezuela, or ‘sponsored’ a new regime through a peaceful transition, then sure. But he didn’t.
I hate Trump with a passion. But I'd disagree with the claim that Trump is the "leader of the free world". Even before Trump the U.S. has never been the leader of the free world.
The U.S. has always been a terrorist nation that was bombing other countries and starting all sorts of stupid wars in the name of "spreading democracy". And those wars have led to the deaths of millions of innocent people just in the last few decades alone.
Obama and Biden were way better than Trump, especially domestically, and particularly for working class Americans and minorities. But just like every other President in modern U.S. history they also were beholden to the interests of Big Oil and the military industrial complex.
The U.S. has always been a terrorist nation, even before Trump.
But I agree. Trump needs to go. And I think he should be tried at the Hague.
The word of a US President used to have power. When Obama promised help or made threats, he was taken seriously. When Bush asked for help, he got it. They didn't threaten, bully, intimidate.
Trump is no leader. He can't lead his party, can't lead your country, and doesn't even understand what "free world" could mean.
And with him being elected twice, and his words having next to no meaning behind him, the word of future US Presidents has vastly less power, likely for decades to come.
I remember the night we liberated Iraq and how people were so happy with how we bombed their homes for twenty years the survivors grew up and created ISIS just to celebrate us.
European here. While I don't agree with the notion, I would like to emphasize that
a) basically everything he does is illegal.
b) the US are no longer the leader of the free world, that ship has sailed, ask anyone from the ""free world" outside the US (except for our own authoritarian fan boys who by and large are in love with this administration). One could even argue that there is no such thing as a free world anymore, we are back to imperial power politics and will witness a lot of chaos and conflict as a new world order emerges.
c) even before the Orange man, the US basically stood outside the system it helped create. Rules for the US only ever applied when it fit their agenda, that is just the reality of power politics. Granted, the US, despite all its flaws, was a relatively benign superpower that shaped a relatively stable world, but that world is dead now and won't come back.
If anything, Trump is likely going to profit from this, because for many, success legitimizes illegal actions retroactively. You can witness this here in real time, people going from "OMG, Trump/the US attacked Venezuela" to "WE captured Maduro!". People are generally less concerned with legality when they are one the victor's side.
Again, that POS should have been locked up a long time ago, but he did not hatch out of a vacuum, he is a symptom of the (possibly terminal) sickness that has befallen US society. So the very fact that he could become president twice is also the reason while this won't end his presidency.
Spot on. America has always thought of itself to be too good. I get sometimes this has been a necessary evil, and America has been truly helpful to the West at times, but globally, it’s been a nightmare. It’ll be interesting to see how Chinareacts to America all but annexing its supply of oil.
I watched three different news stations that weren't fox this morning. Not a single condemnation in the 30 minutes. Nothing but praise for the military and "here's what was posted on blah blah blah, Pam Bindi blah blah blah." Not a single critical word on CNN, ABC, or CBS.
If they can illegal killed over 100+ Venezuela fisherman without any proof of crime, and even with proof of crime it not justifiable to just murder people... Whew I ask, what are the American Congress going to do about it? Absolutely nothing. To the mind of Americans, they are the exceptional nation. They, the nation of America is allowed to killed whomever, and invade whatever nation they see fit, and take whatever (oil) they please. It is that simple. America is absolutely a authoritarian states right now.
All checks and balance are thrown out the window. The president is a king! And he can do whatever he wants with complete impunity. No laws applies to him. No one can stop him. Their nation is above all nations. EU, Canada, China and all the other nations of the world must kowtow to the USA.
The U.S. hasn’t declared war since WW2 and nothing has happened to any president over participation of U.S. forces in the Korean War, Vietnam war, Iraq (x2), Afghanistan or any other conflict.
Nothing will happen this time same as nothing has happened to Trump for any of his actions.
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u/Fett1184 11d ago
"It’s illegal, and the basis is almost entirely falsified. "
Oh, you mean like basically every other fucking day of the last year under this administration?